OK so I did another test, this time with a Squarp Pyramid connected directly to the NDLR. I had a single track set to send 2x CC 73 values (Key). If I monitor the Midi Out data from the Pyramid it confirms that only CC 73 (Value of 1) and CC 73 (Value of 3) are being sent. No note data.
But, when the NDLR receives these CC messages the Key is changed but a note is also sent from the NDLR to my synth.
Digging in further it appears that some CC Data makes the NDLR fire a note whilst others do not. Changing Key does, changing Chord Type does not. The NDLR adds noticeable latency to any updates made via CC changes. So if you go fully CC and set your Chord Degree with CCs (instead of NoteOn) then the Pads are not in sync with the Motifs and Drone patterns.
If you go the other route, and use NoteOn to set the Chord Degree's then the CC changes need to be offset by at least 1/16th note for them to happen in time with the NoteOn messages. This is ok if using a CC value that doesn't trigger a note. However changing the CC of a parameter that does send out a note (like Key Change) means this needs to be placed EXACTLY on the sequencer so the note from that and the note from the NoteOn are in sync with each other - which is pretty difficult and very fiddly.
So some thoughts and critique...
The CC latency is unacceptable, the NDLR is all about Midi and it provides a very comprehensive way to control it via CC. With this in mind, the CC updates need to be accurate and in sync. I've tried this with an Octatrack (it has questionable latency itself when it comes to Midi CC), with Bitwig (pretty rock steady) and Pyramid (very accurate). In all instances using CC fully to sequence the NDLR results in sync issues with the other NDLR parts.
However, it appears using NoteOn is very accurate and plays in sync with Drone and the Motifs. So using NoteOn messages would be usable IF other CC actions didn't trigger notes. In my opinion, only CC 26 (Chord Degree) should play back a note from NDLR. Everything else should be like a layer of influence to that for note value/Chord Degree. This way other things like Key Change would only influence the underlying Chord Degree instead of triggering an out-of-sync new note. The issue of trying to sync the double notes goes away, it still means offsetting midi CC earlier in time to prep the NDLR ahead of the next NoteOn but that's workable (if a little painful).
I don't know what the status is with NDLR updates but I hope this could be addressed.
Overall, I just feel a little frustrated and disappointed. It's an inspiring little box capable of some really incredible music composition, but it has to sync well with sequencers. (I know I could use NDLR as the main clock source and use the Chord Sequencer but that has it's own bugs which mess up timing - which I made a post about the other day).
*sigh*
But, when the NDLR receives these CC messages the Key is changed but a note is also sent from the NDLR to my synth.
Digging in further it appears that some CC Data makes the NDLR fire a note whilst others do not. Changing Key does, changing Chord Type does not. The NDLR adds noticeable latency to any updates made via CC changes. So if you go fully CC and set your Chord Degree with CCs (instead of NoteOn) then the Pads are not in sync with the Motifs and Drone patterns.
If you go the other route, and use NoteOn to set the Chord Degree's then the CC changes need to be offset by at least 1/16th note for them to happen in time with the NoteOn messages. This is ok if using a CC value that doesn't trigger a note. However changing the CC of a parameter that does send out a note (like Key Change) means this needs to be placed EXACTLY on the sequencer so the note from that and the note from the NoteOn are in sync with each other - which is pretty difficult and very fiddly.
So some thoughts and critique...
The CC latency is unacceptable, the NDLR is all about Midi and it provides a very comprehensive way to control it via CC. With this in mind, the CC updates need to be accurate and in sync. I've tried this with an Octatrack (it has questionable latency itself when it comes to Midi CC), with Bitwig (pretty rock steady) and Pyramid (very accurate). In all instances using CC fully to sequence the NDLR results in sync issues with the other NDLR parts.
However, it appears using NoteOn is very accurate and plays in sync with Drone and the Motifs. So using NoteOn messages would be usable IF other CC actions didn't trigger notes. In my opinion, only CC 26 (Chord Degree) should play back a note from NDLR. Everything else should be like a layer of influence to that for note value/Chord Degree. This way other things like Key Change would only influence the underlying Chord Degree instead of triggering an out-of-sync new note. The issue of trying to sync the double notes goes away, it still means offsetting midi CC earlier in time to prep the NDLR ahead of the next NoteOn but that's workable (if a little painful).
I don't know what the status is with NDLR updates but I hope this could be addressed.
Overall, I just feel a little frustrated and disappointed. It's an inspiring little box capable of some really incredible music composition, but it has to sync well with sequencers. (I know I could use NDLR as the main clock source and use the Chord Sequencer but that has it's own bugs which mess up timing - which I made a post about the other day).
*sigh*